Screenplay help- Horror- How far is to far?

[sharry]

i think you should read blasted by sarah kane... it is a play and u can get it easily... it is a theatre play....so read it and just think how the director carried out the actions.... you'll get your answers.... you just write the script the way you want... the director will use it to his benefit in his own way!

i hope this answered your question....

get the stageplay of Blasted by Sarah Kane and read it! it will help you out!

[horrorwriter]

I agree with what you all have said. I think that the term "art" is very subjective. What I think is interesting about the motto: "Good screenplays are those that get bought." is that it could basically be applied to anything that is considered "art". For example, a painting is just a painting until people start considering it "art". This is similar with a book, sculpture, anything. Anyways, that's just something interesting to think about. The point I was making in my post was that I appreciate that this forum seems to be a place where you can come to for help without being criticized. If you don't want to think of writing a screenplay as art then I think we can at least agree that it is a creative endeavor. I think there is definitely an art to storytelling, which is basically what writing a screenplay is, telling a story. So just replace the word "art" with "creativity" in my initial post.

So if you just read it as: "The topic basically dissolved into people claiming I had no creativity and that my idea was "cheap and exploitative". " That should clear up any misconceptions. I definitely agree that films are for entertainment and when people start pushing them into being to "artsy" they cease to be entertaining. This is probably a debate that could go on and on but it is beyond the scope of what I was initially trying to say.

So once again, thanks for the great forum and I look forward to hearing what all of the helpful members have to say!

[rnbrewer]

Screenwriting is a craft that approaches art.  A well-crafted screenplay sells, more often than not; the art lies in how it is crafted.

I would also agree, but I would like to elaborate on the aesthetics. Any one of us could paint the Mona Lisa on a wall using fecal matter and call it art (sadly, there also people in the world who would agree.) Even now, as we speak, there is a debate on whether or not video games count as an art form. The same goes with water color paintings made by kids under the age of ten (there is actually an art exhibit New York.) The fact of the matter is, what is art to one person is fecal matter to another.

For me, movies have always been about entertainment. It's always been about escaping the real world and visiting one that makes me feel good or sad. The minute we start tacking on words or phrases to our films like "art" or "art form" we are taking it out of the realm of entertainment and purely into the realm of art. Don't get me wrong, it's not that I feel there are no artistic elements about film making, because there are. I simply feel it makes a big difference in how we write. If we focus more on entertaining people as apposed to selling them something we call "art", then the real "art" lies in our ability to entertain.  The script, the production process, these are simply modes of delivering the "art of entertainment." The world will never know it's art. That's a good thing. If the audience has to stop and wonder about the artistic value of a film then it has officially lost it's entertainment value. It's no longer about escaping, no longer a world where we live out our fantasies. It becomes a world restricted by values.

In short, I would always aim to entertain. If we can do that our scripts will sell. I'm not 100% positive about that, but I would be willing to bet the odds. 

[uncle_al]

Once again, Ye Mighty Don has the right of it...

Screenwriting is a craft that approaches art.  A well-crafted screenplay sells, more often than not; the art lies in how it is crafted.

The subtle hooks that keep the reader flipping pages... the use of technique to set up, and sometimes defy, the expectations of the reader... These are the artistic touches.

Al B.

[ScriptNurse]

Uh-oh ... the "A" word ... artistic. Motion pictures are, by their very nature, exploitive. The audience is exploited out of their $1-$12 (depending on where you live) because of our seemingly insatiable need to escape from our normal lives.

Screenwriting is not an artistic endeavor. It can be done artistically, but in the end that does not matter because the screenplay is only an outline from which the producer and director can make a movie. The movie is the product. The screenplay is an ingredient.

My motto:  Good screenplays are those that get bought.

Admittedly, some are better than others and, conversely, some are hurlers ... and all along the gamut a writer gets paid and a movie gets made.

[uncle_al]

I'd just like to express my appreciation that you all have created a friendly atmosphere where anyone can come and post and ask questions without being bombarded with negativity. It's great that there are resources like this out there for aspiring writers!

Don has, with considerable help, kept this isle of tranquility a safe haven for the writer in training.  For this we make obeisance For this we should be grateful.  And suggestions, not criticism, are the surest way, I think, to produce results.

The fact that this surprises you is a sad thing to me...

Al B.

[horrorwriter]

Thanks for the advice. I've done something along the lines of what you all have suggested.

By the way, I just wanted to say I'm very surprised at how open minded and accepting everyone seems to be on this forum. I had posted this topic on another forum before I discovered this one. The topic basically dissolved into people claiming I had no artistic ability and that my idea was "cheap and exploitative". I'd just like to express my appreciation that you all have created a friendly atmosphere where anyone can come and post and ask questions without being bombarded with negativity. It's great that there are resources like this out there for aspiring writers!

[uncle_al]

1. I've read in several "how to" screenplay books that you are not supposed to put any camera angles in your script. So my question is how do I illustrate cutting away from the action without using camera angles?

Try this as an example:

INT. SQUADROOM - NIGHT

The two detectives watch the videotape.

ON THE TAPE

The doer raises the left-handed power-assist Johnson spreader, and blips the trigger.  A hideous SQUEAL erupts.

ON THE DETECTIVES

They watch, aghast, as the SQUEAL starts again, sustained this time, and the victim SCREAMS in agony.  One detective recoils in horror, and the other keeps swallowing, trying not to hurl.

2. This isn't really related but I've been wondering this for awhile. Let's say you have a certain song that you think would go excellent with a particular scene. Is it considered a no-no to write about that particular song being played during the scene? If it is something you can do, how would you go about formatting it?

The thing is, a certain song would require copyright clearance and rights acquisition from the copyright holder for use.  The usual plan is to suggest a type of song, rather than a specific one...
There was a scene in American Graffiti where one character was supposed to sing "Some Enchanted Evening" to the girl he was with, but Universal couldn't acquire the rights from Lerner and Loewe for what they considered to be a reasonable price.  So, the scene hit the proverbial "cutting room floor".
Unless it's absolutely ESSENTIAL to the plot, I'd avoid any non-original song.

My two drachmas worth...

Al B.

[rnbrewer]

I don't know about your second question. I've often thought of slipping a few of my favorite songs into a script, but I refrain from doing so on the basis that it COULD be a no-no.

As for the first question, I'll try to answer it as best as I can. I'm not fluent in the Script Formating for this forum, so bear with me.

You typically do not want to put camera angles in your script as those are generally up to the director and cinematographer. There is a slick way of getting around that. Actually, I think Don has a post on here somewhere that gives a perfect example of what I'm trying to explain. You basically write it as a montage like this:

Two disgusted POLICE OFFICERS gawk at a...

TELEVISION

Depicting a man being tortured.

ONE OFFICER

Gags and covers his mouth.

TELEVISION

The monster of a man pulls out his victims guts.

                                          THE END 

     Or something to that affect. It's tough to convey without the actual formating, but hopfully you get the idea.

[horrorwriter]

Thanks for everyones responses!

I would craft this story to imply the extreme violence as it's likely that, given a proper setup, the reader will make the violence more violent than if you explicitly showed it.

I have had others tell me similar things, so I've begun writing my screenplay with this in mind. I have a few follow up questions for you all:

1. I've read in several "how to" screenplay books that you are not supposed to put any camera angles in your script. So my question is how do I illustrate cutting away from the action without using camera angles?

As an example: I have a scene in which police are watching a video of someone being tortured. I want to have the viewer see the torture implement and then cut away to show the horrified reactions of the police offers watching the tape.

Does anyone have any advice on how to accomplish this WITHOUT using a description about camera angles?

2. This isn't really related but I've been wondering this for awhile. Let's say you have a certain song that you think would go excellent with a particular scene. Is it considered a no-no to write about that particular song being played during the scene? If it is something you can do, how would you go about formatting it?

Thanks for everyones help!

[uncle_al]

Some times it's what we DON'T see that frightens us most.

Abso-freaking-lutely.
The muted scratching just beyond the range of your flashlight in the tunnels... the almost supersonic *SQUEAK* as you crawl through the earth...  These are the little extras that raise the gooseflesh in the audience.  Not the FX shot of ten thousand rabid rats in a charge en masse.

Al B.

[rnbrewer]

Does the violence serve the story? In other words, is it absolutely necessary that it be violent?

the reader will make the violence more violent than if you explicitly showed it.

Some times it's what we DON'T see that frightens us most. Look at JAWS. They had a huge shark built for the film that didn't even work. So they scrapped the machine and Spielberg opted to shoot numerous scenes (if not most of the film) without the shark. JAWS is still considered one of the scariest, if not THE scariest film of all time.

[Jenafer]

I had the same dilemma when I started to write about a serial killer.  You could tell your story from the point of view of the police..  and just have the mutilated bodies show up.  However, you would have to weave a good story with interesting characters from this viewpoint.

There is the other option of watering down the violence a little..  push the edges of violent behaviour without getting absolutely repulsive.  This is an intuitive thing on the the part of the writer.

All the best, Jenafer   

[uncle_al]

I have to agree with Don.  He is, after all, Always Right, simply because He Is.

The MegaIMAX TotalTHXSurroundSound Full-Immersion Illusion Machine^TM between your ears is much more graphic and affecting than any motion picture... look at the way Old Time Radio affected people; Orson Welles and the Mercury Theatre on the Air's production of War of the Worlds back in October 1938 is a prime example.  Or the eyewitness account of the tragedy of the Zeppelin Hindenburg at Lakehurst, New Jersey, as covered by NBC Radio... when synchronized with the newsreel footage, it's effective, but even the mind pictures from the broadcast alone are vivid enough.

Al B.

[ScriptNurse]

I would craft this story to imply the extreme violence as it's likely that, given a proper set-up, the reader will make the violence more violent than if you explicitly showed it.